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	<title>Comments on: Media tie-in fiction</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/</link>
	<description>...science fiction and other stuff from jonathan strahan...</description>
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		<title>By: Blue Tyson</title>
		<link>http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/comment-page-1/#comment-197893</link>
		<dc:creator>Blue Tyson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Sep 2008 04:10:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/#comment-197893</guid>
		<description>Well, sure that can be part of it, that I like horror more than cheesy fairy stories, certainly. :)

Obviously some will be good, and some I will like - but that is not the same thing. e.g. there is Fables, and then there is &#039;let&#039;s make Cinderella a twentieth century girl and that&#039;s it,&#039; sort of thing.  Deviations from basic story pretty much zero, or very minor.  While they aren&#039;t going to bump Hellboy off in one of those stories pretty obviously - same goes for most of those, too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, sure that can be part of it, that I like horror more than cheesy fairy stories, certainly. :)</p>
<p>Obviously some will be good, and some I will like &#8211; but that is not the same thing. e.g. there is Fables, and then there is &#8216;let&#8217;s make Cinderella a twentieth century girl and that&#8217;s it,&#8217; sort of thing.  Deviations from basic story pretty much zero, or very minor.  While they aren&#8217;t going to bump Hellboy off in one of those stories pretty obviously &#8211; same goes for most of those, too.</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan</title>
		<link>http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/comment-page-1/#comment-196924</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 11:59:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/#comment-196924</guid>
		<description>I couldn&#039;t disagree more about fairytale retellings.  Tie-ins and fairytale retellings are completely different.  Why?  Tie-ins come with bibles that tell you in detail what can or can&#039;t be done.  Fairy tale retellings have nothing like that.  The level of creativity that I&#039;ve seen invested into retellings is exceptionally high.  I wonder, based on your previous statements about fantasy, if this more reflects your tastes than the fiction :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I couldn&#8217;t disagree more about fairytale retellings.  Tie-ins and fairytale retellings are completely different.  Why?  Tie-ins come with bibles that tell you in detail what can or can&#8217;t be done.  Fairy tale retellings have nothing like that.  The level of creativity that I&#8217;ve seen invested into retellings is exceptionally high.  I wonder, based on your previous statements about fantasy, if this more reflects your tastes than the fiction :)</p>
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		<title>By: Blue Tyson</title>
		<link>http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/comment-page-1/#comment-196829</link>
		<dc:creator>Blue Tyson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Sep 2008 05:20:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/#comment-196829</guid>
		<description>Look at all the Cinderella, Snow White and other assorted fairy stories like that, too, speaking of tie-ins.

Creativity is pretty thin there, too.  I am sure you have picked out some of those as &#039;bests&#039; though?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Look at all the Cinderella, Snow White and other assorted fairy stories like that, too, speaking of tie-ins.</p>
<p>Creativity is pretty thin there, too.  I am sure you have picked out some of those as &#8216;bests&#8217; though?</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan</title>
		<link>http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/comment-page-1/#comment-196547</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 10:49:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/#comment-196547</guid>
		<description>Hey Sean:  I think &#039;thin&#039; is proving to be a very poor explanation.  It relates to something in the stories being watered down, or diluted.  Now that view may simply reflect my own disinterest in the &#039;further adventures&#039; scenario which underpins a lot of tie-ins (and non tie-in sequels).  I don&#039;t know.   Setting aside &#039;thinness&#039;, I agree that we all want a varied diet.  I love Neal Stephenson, but I want to read David Weber or Terry Pratchett sometimes.  I read Gene Wolfe and love and admire his work, but I couldn&#039;t read it all of the time.  I&#039;d also add, I&#039;d hoped I&#039;d been making it clear that this post reflects my own preferences for my own diet.  It&#039;s not supposed to be some gatekeeper&#039;s pronouncement suggesting what someone should or shouldn&#039;t read.  People who enjoy tie-ins should definitely read them when and as they want to, and can expect no criticism or condescension from me. - J</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Sean:  I think &#8216;thin&#8217; is proving to be a very poor explanation.  It relates to something in the stories being watered down, or diluted.  Now that view may simply reflect my own disinterest in the &#8216;further adventures&#8217; scenario which underpins a lot of tie-ins (and non tie-in sequels).  I don&#8217;t know.   Setting aside &#8216;thinness&#8217;, I agree that we all want a varied diet.  I love Neal Stephenson, but I want to read David Weber or Terry Pratchett sometimes.  I read Gene Wolfe and love and admire his work, but I couldn&#8217;t read it all of the time.  I&#8217;d also add, I&#8217;d hoped I&#8217;d been making it clear that this post reflects my own preferences for my own diet.  It&#8217;s not supposed to be some gatekeeper&#8217;s pronouncement suggesting what someone should or shouldn&#8217;t read.  People who enjoy tie-ins should definitely read them when and as they want to, and can expect no criticism or condescension from me. &#8211; J</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan</title>
		<link>http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/comment-page-1/#comment-196546</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 10:44:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/#comment-196546</guid>
		<description>Earl:  As I say, I have no quibble with tie-in fiction, and absolutely no second thoughts about the people who write it.  Writing to put the bread on the table is a completely valid thing to do, and some tie-in stuff is very good.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Earl:  As I say, I have no quibble with tie-in fiction, and absolutely no second thoughts about the people who write it.  Writing to put the bread on the table is a completely valid thing to do, and some tie-in stuff is very good.</p>
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		<title>By: Sean Williams</title>
		<link>http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/comment-page-1/#comment-196435</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean Williams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 05:33:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/#comment-196435</guid>
		<description>Sometimes &quot;thin&quot; might be just what the doctor ordered (forgive the Who pun, there).

Not everyone can subsist on a diet of 100% pure original.  Most people crave, even if it&#039;s only occasionally, something that harks back to the familiar and well-loved, where catch-phrases and names substitute for elegantly rendered text describing the new and unfamiliar.

Existing on &quot;thin&quot; alone would be a bad thing, of course, whether it&#039;s putting food on your table or stories in your head.  There&#039;s a balance to be reached, and I guess it&#039;s different for everyone.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sometimes &#8220;thin&#8221; might be just what the doctor ordered (forgive the Who pun, there).</p>
<p>Not everyone can subsist on a diet of 100% pure original.  Most people crave, even if it&#8217;s only occasionally, something that harks back to the familiar and well-loved, where catch-phrases and names substitute for elegantly rendered text describing the new and unfamiliar.</p>
<p>Existing on &#8220;thin&#8221; alone would be a bad thing, of course, whether it&#8217;s putting food on your table or stories in your head.  There&#8217;s a balance to be reached, and I guess it&#8217;s different for everyone.</p>
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		<title>By: Earl Cooley III</title>
		<link>http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/comment-page-1/#comment-196133</link>
		<dc:creator>Earl Cooley III</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Sep 2008 16:10:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/#comment-196133</guid>
		<description>As a practical matter, fiction which puts bread on the table of writers whose works I enjoy is a good thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a practical matter, fiction which puts bread on the table of writers whose works I enjoy is a good thing.</p>
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		<title>By: tycho garen</title>
		<link>http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/comment-page-1/#comment-196105</link>
		<dc:creator>tycho garen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Sep 2008 14:41:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/#comment-196105</guid>
		<description>Is it true that tie-in books have changed a lot in sometime 5 to 10 years ago. 

Once upon a time, the star trek books were pretty darn nifty, written by pretty interesting authors. Uhura&#039;s Song by Janet Kagan is amazing and I can think of a bunch of older ones written by good writers that did interesting and entertaining things. 

Some questions:

And now? Not so much? Are there more of them? Has science fiction media become more popular, so rights holders are more interested in getting more merchandise/tie ins out? (and a lower quality as a result?) Are there more franchises now that there were in the 70s and 80s? (that&#039;s pretty clearly a yes.) Does the incresing avilaiblity of fan fiction online mean that there&#039;s also less demand for tie-in stuff? And I think as a mitigating variable I think that the falling price of book production (relative to 20 or 30 or 40 years ago) is really important. 

But I agree fully about not caring very much about contemporary tie-ins...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is it true that tie-in books have changed a lot in sometime 5 to 10 years ago. </p>
<p>Once upon a time, the star trek books were pretty darn nifty, written by pretty interesting authors. Uhura&#8217;s Song by Janet Kagan is amazing and I can think of a bunch of older ones written by good writers that did interesting and entertaining things. </p>
<p>Some questions:</p>
<p>And now? Not so much? Are there more of them? Has science fiction media become more popular, so rights holders are more interested in getting more merchandise/tie ins out? (and a lower quality as a result?) Are there more franchises now that there were in the 70s and 80s? (that&#8217;s pretty clearly a yes.) Does the incresing avilaiblity of fan fiction online mean that there&#8217;s also less demand for tie-in stuff? And I think as a mitigating variable I think that the falling price of book production (relative to 20 or 30 or 40 years ago) is really important. </p>
<p>But I agree fully about not caring very much about contemporary tie-ins&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Blue Tyson</title>
		<link>http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/comment-page-1/#comment-195544</link>
		<dc:creator>Blue Tyson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 16:33:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/#comment-195544</guid>
		<description>Interesting.  I certainly have a bias against fantasy series aimed at kids given I am not one, I think.  Preferring the horror end of things may have something to do with it, too.

The only thing I have read of that stuff (I think) is from his collection.  While it was ok, I found it bland, uninvolving, predictable and lacking in maturity (perfectly understandable in a series aimed at younger readers, of course), depth, and good writing, so not exactly making me want to go further.  I&#039;ve flipped through a book, looks about the same to me.

Nothing in that that is in the class of any Hellboy work, in general (early Christopher Golden example aside).

Does comparing a novel series make sense here?  That would be more comparing say Piccirilli or Hodge&#039;s novels to the Hellboy variety.  Because then we get Hellboy story to Perdido Street Station.  Whereas a comparison to &#039;Jack&#039;, for example, is pretty reasonable.  PSS of course trumps anything anybody in that anthology has written or ever will write, pretty much.

Doing a YB series you didn&#039;t like would make all that reading worse, too.  Ouch.  Even if it looks good in the Super-Editor portfolio.

The Hellboy series is certainly upper-tier as far as Tie-Ins go, I think.

There&#039;s not even a dozen of &#039;em (three anthologies, all pretty good - Odd/Odder/Oddest).  So not actually going to have the same problem as the legions of Star Trek/Star Wars books, etc.  

Couple of movie books for them too of course, so one of those entertaining novel based on a movie based on a graphic novel things.  The first one was by Yvonne Navarro, no slouch, either.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting.  I certainly have a bias against fantasy series aimed at kids given I am not one, I think.  Preferring the horror end of things may have something to do with it, too.</p>
<p>The only thing I have read of that stuff (I think) is from his collection.  While it was ok, I found it bland, uninvolving, predictable and lacking in maturity (perfectly understandable in a series aimed at younger readers, of course), depth, and good writing, so not exactly making me want to go further.  I&#8217;ve flipped through a book, looks about the same to me.</p>
<p>Nothing in that that is in the class of any Hellboy work, in general (early Christopher Golden example aside).</p>
<p>Does comparing a novel series make sense here?  That would be more comparing say Piccirilli or Hodge&#8217;s novels to the Hellboy variety.  Because then we get Hellboy story to Perdido Street Station.  Whereas a comparison to &#8216;Jack&#8217;, for example, is pretty reasonable.  PSS of course trumps anything anybody in that anthology has written or ever will write, pretty much.</p>
<p>Doing a YB series you didn&#8217;t like would make all that reading worse, too.  Ouch.  Even if it looks good in the Super-Editor portfolio.</p>
<p>The Hellboy series is certainly upper-tier as far as Tie-Ins go, I think.</p>
<p>There&#8217;s not even a dozen of &#8216;em (three anthologies, all pretty good &#8211; Odd/Odder/Oddest).  So not actually going to have the same problem as the legions of Star Trek/Star Wars books, etc.  </p>
<p>Couple of movie books for them too of course, so one of those entertaining novel based on a movie based on a graphic novel things.  The first one was by Yvonne Navarro, no slouch, either.</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan</title>
		<link>http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/comment-page-1/#comment-195474</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 11:11:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/#comment-195474</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s true I don&#039;t have a lot of interest in pulp horror - the main reason I avoid editing horror projects (I actually turned down editing a year&#039;s best horror for that reason).

On the Nix and thinness - Garth is a good writer and he does a great job with both stories.  I wouldn&#039;t expect his story to be weaker than an original.  So what do I mean by thin, if you take Garth as an example?  Hmmm.  Allowing that I wouldn&#039;t choose Garth as an example I think there&#039;s a greater textual depth to his Old Kingdom and Keys to the Kingdom work. It&#039;s more engaging, more involving.  Of course, that might just be me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s true I don&#8217;t have a lot of interest in pulp horror &#8211; the main reason I avoid editing horror projects (I actually turned down editing a year&#8217;s best horror for that reason).</p>
<p>On the Nix and thinness &#8211; Garth is a good writer and he does a great job with both stories.  I wouldn&#8217;t expect his story to be weaker than an original.  So what do I mean by thin, if you take Garth as an example?  Hmmm.  Allowing that I wouldn&#8217;t choose Garth as an example I think there&#8217;s a greater textual depth to his Old Kingdom and Keys to the Kingdom work. It&#8217;s more engaging, more involving.  Of course, that might just be me.</p>
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		<title>By: Blue Tyson</title>
		<link>http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/comment-page-1/#comment-195472</link>
		<dc:creator>Blue Tyson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Sep 2008 11:05:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jonathanstrahan.com.au/wp/2008/09/03/media-tie-in-fiction/#comment-195472</guid>
		<description>Nope, that creatively thin thing doesn&#039;t make a lot of sense.

The Nix story in Dreaming Again and his Hellboy story is &#039;thin&#039; compared to that, how?  Or the vampire hunter one, etc.

Explain. :)

It is also possible you have little interest in/don&#039;t like pulp horror as such, either?  Speaking of biases, etc.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nope, that creatively thin thing doesn&#8217;t make a lot of sense.</p>
<p>The Nix story in Dreaming Again and his Hellboy story is &#8216;thin&#8217; compared to that, how?  Or the vampire hunter one, etc.</p>
<p>Explain. :)</p>
<p>It is also possible you have little interest in/don&#8217;t like pulp horror as such, either?  Speaking of biases, etc.</p>
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